Authored by: SJD on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 12:33 PM GMT+4
Ask Sara Palin about being considered innocent first? Though she was found not responsible or exonerated after the election, she was labeled and still considered bad by some today.. -it's only fair when it suits your purpose?
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"Government's view of the economy: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. If it stops moving, subsidize it." -Ronald Reagan
Change You Can See Happening in Front of your Face.
Authored by: Maus Anon E on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 02:53 AM GMT+4
Mike,
That is change. If this happened in the Bush administration, he would have told the press to screw off, and would have blamed the opposing party for any accusations of wrong-doing.
A candidate for appointed office who holds his President and the people of the United States above his own ambition is a big, big change. But I can understand why it seems so unusual to you.
-M.
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Freemarket economy: A socialist system in which workers' earnings are redistributed to affluent citizens.
Authored by: cgrotke on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 02:59 AM GMT+4
You forgot Hillary Clinton. And Charlie Rangel, for that matter, though
he isn't part of the Obama team. Both have similar accusations
against them.
If proved to be true, they'll join Ted Stevens, Duke Cunningham, Lisa
Murakowski, Don Young, etc. in the lists of the corrupt. They might
also be found innocent. Time will tell.
I see much more difference between us at the bottom and those at
the top than I see between parties in power. Once the income and
power hits a certain level they seem to start thinking they can do
anything.
Authored by: Mr. Buddy Love on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 03:27 AM GMT+4
I would say that, 'tis true that absolute power corrupts absolutely. But
if that is the case, We the People are guilty of not checking that
power, of not being more involved and in not electing more
responsible people. My friends and relatives in NM warned me that Bill
Richardson was corrupt a long time ago. I also knew about Blagojevich
from ten years back, when he first ran for Congress. There are some
politicians who are corrupt but have done great things, like Ted
Kennedy. Then there are some who are corrupt as hell, should never
have been elected by standards of decency and fairness, like LBJ, yet
it was he who got the Civil Rights legislation passed, and the voting
rights. Go figure.
Although you never insinuated this, I should remind people that there
have been many honest and noble politicians in both of the major
parties, people like Hubert Humphrey, Frank Church, Howard
Metzenbahm, but most people elected to high office are of an
imperfect timbre, not pure or always noble, but good dealers who
know when to hold their cards close but also when to put them on the
table. Abraham Lincoln was the best example I can find of one of
these types.
I would say that ANY political party that becomes big and successful,
be it Whigs, Republican-Democrats (Jefferson's party), Democrats,
Federalists, Republicans, Greens (if they ever do here), etc.--- hold
the potential to become corrupt, after purist birth at first. There
probably never will be a political party pure as the driven snow, as
John Adams was wont to say. But being a practical person that I am, I
would like to see some badly needed reforms, even if someone's
sacred cow has to be gutted in the process of sausage-making that
goes on every day that Congress is in session. Reform is a never-
ending task, and must go on, even if all we have to work with are
human beings with flaws and faults.
Authored by: SJD on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 12:47 PM GMT+4
Here's a good list of 2008 favorites:
Rob Blagojevich (D-IL)- Caught in a criminal bribe taking pay-to-play scheme to sell Barack Obama's senate seat to the highest bidder
John Edwards(D-NC)- Had an affair with an underling as his wife was dying of cancer, an affair he hid from public knowledge as he ran for president
Kwame Kilpatrick (D-MI)- Sentenced to 4 months in jail for obstruction of justice for impeding a criminal investigation into his actions as Detroit's mayor
Larry Langford (D-AL)- Birmingham, Alabama mayor arrested on charges of bribery, fraud, money laundering and filing a false income tax statement
Tim Mahoney (D-FL)- Replaced sex crazed Rep. Mark Foley in Florida while hiding his own extra-marital affairs from the voters, then lost his bid for reelection once the truth came out
Elliot Spitzer (D-NY)- Caught with a prostitute, lost his job as governor of New York
Ted Stevens (R-AK)- Faces jail for bribery and making false statements to the feds
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"Government's view of the economy: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. If it stops moving, subsidize it." -Ronald Reagan
Authored by: annikee on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 02:59 AM GMT+4
Who was number 1?
Of course, nobody's talking about the Clintons having the same deal in 2004 with an educational firm.
And I might add, how many of Bush's Cabinet should've resigned over their individual scandals but didn't? Gov. Richardson is withdrawing not only before serving but before any determination. After the Palin fiasco, the Repubics have no room to comment.
Authored by: Mr. Buddy Love on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 03:02 AM GMT+4
It's going to take some time, but the Obama Administration will have
plenty of work cleaning up the ELEPHANT-SIZED DUNG that is: 1. The
Iraq War; 2. The failed economy; 3. The decaying infrastructure and
schools that have gone to waste under eight years of Bush; and 4. The
eight years spent doing nothing to prepare us for climate change.
The first change to come will be a massive new economic stimulus
package to help alleviate the worst hit to the US middle class since
Hoover's great depression. The next steps will be to put us on the
road to universal health care, stem cell engineering and money toward
green energy and new rail infrastructure, and an education system
that puts Americans back into competitive standing with the other
producer nations. The last step will be to restore international
confidence in our country and in our people, by ending wars of
unilateral empirical decree and an end to lies about weapons of mass
destruction and the illegal outing of CIA agents who dared to call the
liars in the White House on their lies.
Change is coming in two weeks, mr. mike. The GOP (mostly in the
old Confederate states which make up the base of your withered party
now) tried hard to stop it, but they failed. Now what you tried so
desperately to stop is gearing up to make these changes.
Bill Richardson, the fizzled "Blago-gate" and other pathetic attempts
to derail this change won't work. Change is gonna come!
Authored by: SJD on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 03:59 AM GMT+4
Interesting is how this matter didn't surface during the nomination process when Richardson was running for President or after he announced his support for Obama. And how did this get passed the Obama team during the vetting process?
One other big thing... http://www.huffingtonpost.com/harold-ambler/mr-gore-apology-accepted_b_154982.html This 1/3/09 article in the "Huffington Post" (OMG) will throw you for a spin.. seems more are starting to look at global warming hysteria realistically....rather then a 4 year political mandate to pay more in taxes, so government scientists can pretend to control the weather, and you.
Sadly, according to AP, 314 U.S. soldiers died in Iraq in 2008. Alarmingly, the Chicago Tribune reported that Chicago closed out 2008 with 509 homicides. Now that's just Chicago... Wow, it's literally safer in Iraq than it is in Chicago. The median Chicago homicides over the last decade is 700/year.
--- "Government's view of the economy: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. If it stops moving, subsidize it." -Ronald Reagan
Authored by: Mr. Buddy Love on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 09:05 AM GMT+4
>>Interesting is how this matter didn't surface during the nomination
process when Richardson was running for President or after he
announced his support for Obama. And how did this get passed the
Obama team during the vetting process? <<
Anyone can run for president, even if they are as crooked as Richard
Nixon or the Bushes. As for the Obama team catching everything,
they can't. Even the CIA makes mistakes in hiring, and they're
supposed to be some of the best fact checkers on the planet. And,
anyway----WHAT HAPPENED TO THE "BLAGO-GATE" SCANDAL?? I
thought you said this would stick to and harm Obama? Won't you at
least admit that you got this one wrong?
>>One other big thing... http://www.huffingtonpost.com/harold-
ambler/mr-gore-apology-accepted_b_154982.html This 1/3/09 article
in the "Huffington Post" (OMG) will throw you for a spin.. seems more
are starting to look at global warming hysteria realistically....rather
then a 4 year political mandate to pay more in taxes, so government
scientists can pretend to control the weather, and you. <<
"Government scientists"?? You mean, like the ones working for Bush?
Please! I suppose industry scientists, like those who lied for decades
so that the tobacco companies could keep poisoning people are proof
that industry can be trusted, but government can't?
>>Sadly, according to AP, 314 U.S. soldiers died in Iraq in 2008.
Alarmingly, the Chicago Tribune reported that Chicago closed out 2008
with 509 homicides. Now that's just Chicago... Wow, it's literally safer
in Iraq than it is in Chicago. The median Chicago homicides over the
last decade is 700/year.<<
What you leave out of the equation is the number of private Iraqi
citizens and the number of private contractors working for Blackwater
(who don't have to report to the media their death tally) you are
leaving out of your comparison. But given the facts, do you REALLY
think Iraq is safer than Chicago? That's just absurd!
Authored by: Floyd on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 01:18 PM GMT+4
"...it's literally safer in Iraq than it is in Chicago"
If everyone in Chicago is heavily armed and wearing flak jackets, helmets and driving armored vehicles really fast to avoid the improvised explosives then this is a valid comparison.
Authored by: xteeth on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 01:11 PM GMT+4
Okay lets compare. Foley, Abramoff, Hastert, Frist, Delay, Raymond, Kidan, Ney, Noe, Beward, Newton, Cheney, Crawford, Safavian, Doolittle, Doyle, Cunningham, Ebbers, Craig, Lay, Renzi, Ryan, Fletcher, Siljander, Kidan, Tobin, McGee, Griffin, Gene Chandler,all Republicans in the past seven years, these off the top of my head and not including the CEO's and the revolving door of the military industrial congressional complex. How about Great Job Browny of FEMA, and the head of regulation of mining where all those miners were killed and on and on. How about Bernie Taupin and his medicare drug self employment plan? How about the subborned journalists Gooding and Armstrong and who was that gay guy getting the softball questions at presidential news conferences ah yes, Gagnon. Compare that with now Spitzer, Williams, and Waters. I think the scales tip way toward the belief that if all you talk about as important is money, you get money based corruption.
Sen. Bill Frist: The report accuses him of violating federal campaign finance laws in how he disclosed a campaign loan. It also calls for an inquiry over his recent sale of stock in HCA Inc., his family's hospital corporation. The sale has raised questions about possible insider dealing. Frist aides confirmed Friday that the SEC was investigating. They have denied claims of campaign finance violations.
Rep. Roy Blunt: The report criticizes him for trying to insert provisions into bills that would have benefited, in one case, a client of his lobbyist son and in another case, the employer of his lobbyist girlfriend, now his wife.
Sen. Conrad Burns: The report says that questions arose over $3 million in appropriations he earmarked for an Indian tribe in Michigan that was a client of lobbyist Abramoff. The senator received substantial campaign contributions from Abramoff and various clients.
"Sen. Burns did nothing wrong, and any accusation to the contrary is pure politics," said James Pendleton, his director of communications. He said Burns had earmarked the appropriation at the request of the Michigan congressional delegation.
Rep. Bob Ney: The report says the chairman of the House Administration Committee went on a golf outing to Scotland in 2002, arranged by Abramoff, at a time when the congressman was trying to insert a provision into legislation to benefit one of Abramoff's tribal clients.
Ney reported to the House that the trip was paid for entirely by the National Center for Public Policy Research, a conservative think tank, which denied paying any of the costs. Ney has said he had been duped by Abramoff.
Rep. Tom Feeney: The report says he incorrectly reported that a golf trip to Scotland with Abramoff in 2003 was paid for by the National Center for Public Policy Research, which denied it. A Feeney aide said the congressman had been misled. Questions also have arisen about two other privately funded trips.
Rep. Richard W. Pombo: He paid his wife and brother $357,325 in campaign funds in the last four years, the report says. He also supported the wind-power industry before the Department of Interior without disclosing that his parents received hundreds of thousands of dollars in royalties from wind-power turbines on their ranch.
Brian Kennedy, a spokesman for Pombo, said that "each of the charges is baseless." He called the watchdog group "a Democratic attack group, and all of their charges should be taken with a grain of salt."
Rep. Maxine Waters: The report cites a December 2004 Los Angeles Times investigation disclosing how members of the congresswoman's family have made more than $1 million in the last eight years by doing business with companies, candidates and causes that Waters has helped. Before publication of the Times investigation last year, Waters declined to be interviewed, but said of her family members: "They do their business, and I do mine."
Sen. Rick Santorum (R-Pa.): The report says he encountered controversy over disclosures that Pennsylvania taxpayers paid for his children's schooling while they lived in Virginia. Santorum maintained he did nothing wrong, and has pulled his children out of the school, according to reports.
Reps. Randy "Duke" Cunningham and William J. Jefferson: Both congressional veterans are under federal investigation.
Cunningham, who has announced that he will not run for reelection, faces questions over his dealings with a defense contractor who allegedly overpaid him when he purchased Cunningham's house. Jefferson is under scrutiny for his role in an overseas business deal. Normally the House ethics committee does not hold inquiries while criminal investigations are underway.
Rep. Charles H. Taylor (R-N.C.): The report says that questions have been raised about his private business interests, including a savings and loan in Asheville, N.C., and personal business interests in Russia.
Rep. Marilyn N. Musgrave (R-Colo.) and Rep. Rick Renzi (R-Ariz.): Both second-term House members encountered criticisms tied to campaign activities, the report says.
Musgrave was accused of misusing her congressional office for campaign purposes. Renzi was accused of financing portions of his 2002 campaign with improper loans.
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"Some people cause happiness wherever they go, others whenever they go." Oscar Wilde
Authored by: Tad Montgomery on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 04:37 PM GMT+4
It's sad to me that people tend to ignore the faults of leaders in the party we favor and exaggerate the faults of leaders in the party we oppose. Human nature, I suppose. Adversarial democracy, replete with paternal projections.
Authored by: pjmelton on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 05:28 PM GMT+4
I think the question is less whether someone is at fault and more WHO is at fault. Mr. Mike is trying to smear Obama for something someone else did, and I find that objectionable witch-hunt style politics reminiscent of the Clinton Witch-Hunts. Richardson was a complete putz to accept the nomination knowing he was under investigation for something so serious. That doesn't mean Obama did something wrong.
Authored by: annikee on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 06:30 PM GMT+4
That's correct- much like nobody held McCain responsible for Palin's indictments- and just where was she "exonerated" anyway? That ain't the way I heard it, Charlie!
Authored by: mr.mike on Tuesday, January 06 2009 @ 01:46 AM GMT+4
You can't tell me Obama didn't know he was under investiagation when he was picked. If he didn't he's a bigger putz than Richardson.
The reason I posted this is because his presidency hasn't even started yet and look at the things that have cropped up. I'm not blaming him. But the corruption is so deep he 's having a hard time picking people, even the cleanest looking ones, to fill his cabinet. It's a shame really the poor guy hasn't even taken the oath yet and the people around him are causing such turmoil.
Imagine what goes on we don't hear about. Think about the politicians that are "professional" in keeping scandals quiet for years.
BTW I didn't state anywhere that Republicans were innocent. You guys assumed hat.
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Vermont, where people are milked more than cows when it comes to taxes.
Authored by: cgrotke on Monday, January 05 2009 @ 06:50 PM GMT+4
It looks like everyone is in agreement that corrupt politicians are bad.
And that there are corrupt politicians in both parties and have been for
centuries.
So what are we going to do it about, my friends on the right left and
in the middle?
List them and try to point out who did is the greater of multiple evils?
If I were a corrupt politician I'd laugh my way to my expense account
and continue providing favors for contributions while y'all pick each
other apart.
It's not right or left, it's up and down, and anyone who isn't worth
more than a million is down with the 97% of Americans who are worth
less than that. I think that is most of us.
If we work together maybe we'll get somewhere. Otherwise we'll be
doing this forever.
