The Selectboard did not support $30,000 for a person to get an expanded recycling system up and running. The town is crying for help in Planning that has a town plan to write and a huge backlog in zoning regs to update not to mention the new stuff that pops up every day. There is no Assistant Town Manager. The Town Manager's secretary is trying to cover Human Resources. The Selectboard tells us at Town Meeting that they cut every unnecessary penny out of the budget that they could find.
And now they are asking the citizens to take out another loan for $300,000 (plus interest) to rebuild the sidewalks on Main St, which until now no one seems to have noticed to be in particularly bad shape, just because the state will kick in another 1.2 million to do the 1.5 million dollar job.
$300,000 for sidewalks out of Brattleboro citizens pockets. That is more than double the amount of money we squeezed out for every social service need combined!
I am dumbfounded! What is going on here?
And Town Meeting Members are voting on this on Friday.
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300,000 Dollars For Sidewalks!
Authored by: SpudHill on Wednesday, May 06 2009 @ 07:36 AM GMT+4
The sidewalks seem just fine to me...am I missing something here? Do we have to do things just because some of the money is available through grants whether we need them or not?
Authored by: Stella on Thursday, May 07 2009 @ 11:35 AM GMT+4
Let's not loose sight of the fact that the 1.2 million in "grant" money is also taxpayer funds... be they state or federal. This rep says that Main Street sidewalks are not in need of a complete redo... other comments and input welcome, particularly from District 3...
Authored by: pjmelton on Thursday, May 07 2009 @ 05:00 PM GMT+4
The places that need all new pedestrian infrastructure are West B., Canal Street and Putney Road - basically everywhere EXCEPT Main Street downtown!
I don't object to spending good money to make sure we have good sidewalks, but this expenditure seems excessive unless there is a good justification for it besides "but they will give us matching funds!" That's like buying Ding-Dongs just because you have a coupon. You're not saving money there; you're spending more than you would have.
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"Economic laws are not made by nature. They are made by human beings." -- FDR
Authored by: SpudHill on Wednesday, May 06 2009 @ 09:05 AM GMT+4
Thanks...good point but can't they just do patch repairs on these places. For a wheelchair you would need a mini-ramp patch of concrete. I'm curious if it would make more sense to do repairs and cost a lot less...
I'm just getting the impression that if there are matching funds available we feel we must do it....which in this economic times may not make sense.
If we spend $300,000 what is the cost per taxpayer in general?
Anyone have an idea, it seems like a lot of money but I'm not sure what it breaks down to per taxpayer.
Authored by: SpudHill on Wednesday, May 06 2009 @ 09:09 AM GMT+4
Great photos....
Are these all Main Street?
Appear to be other locales also?
Judging from the post the $300,000 will only be spent on Main Street which isn't that long so I'm assuming it's a total redo????
Authored by: cgrotke on Wednesday, May 06 2009 @ 09:49 AM GMT+4
Main Street only - from down about "malfunction junction" to near
Well's
fountain. This would fix any bad spots on Main Street sidewalks, and
add
wheelchair access where it is currently missing.
No other town sidewalks included in this one.
To my eye, many of the sidewalks down there are fine and to replace
them would be an unnecessary expense at this time. Problem spots
and
wheelchairs should be dealt with, though. Patching seems like a good
compromise, but we probably wouldn't share the costs with the state
if we
went that way.
If I were a Town Meeting Rep, I'd walk downtown and take a look.
Then I'd
ask myself, would I replace all of this if it were at my house?
Authored by: SpudHill on Wednesday, May 06 2009 @ 10:11 AM GMT+4
Yeah, like it's so much smarter to spend $300,000 on Main Street since we're getting the grant on top of that than spend the $10,000 it would take to do the patches and make some wheelchair access spots.
Your last point frightens me because it may be that the answer is yes, this might be the way the town reps handle their personal expenses....who knows....do people have to submit credit reports and financial histories before running.....now there's a thought!
Authored by: spoon on Wednesday, May 06 2009 @ 10:09 PM GMT+4
I believe every $100,000 spent adds about a penny or slightly more to the tax rate. Thus the sidewals repairs would add about 3 1/4 to 3 1/2 cents to the rate per hundred. If one's property is assessed at $200,000 it would add maybe 64 to 68 dollars to one's annual tax bill.
Authored by: spoon on Thursday, May 07 2009 @ 03:46 PM GMT+4
I made an error here. The amount of money it would cost each taxpayer is the total and would be spread out over the length of the loan. This softens the blow but doesn't change the point. It is one of the most unnecessary expenses I have ever seen.
Authored by: spoon on Wednesday, May 06 2009 @ 10:27 PM GMT+4
A former government employee observed that it would be highly unusual for such money to be available only for sidewalks. I've read a lot about designations for stimulus money, if this is the original source, and I'd be surprised if the Feds said Let's provide X billions for repairing sidewalks. I have heard nothing about for what else we could use these leveraged funds.
If we were absolutely forced to cough up $300,000 to invest in sidewalks it makes much more sense to do sidewalks in West Bratt in the areas covered by the new West B Master Plan. I believe the area out by the Chelsea diner is planned to become a mini town center. The million and a half leveraged by our three hundred grand would go a very long way towards moving our plans off the drawing board and creating the kind of district we really want.
The town Finance Director offered a quick thought that perhaps we could justify borrowing 300 grand now by deleting for the next five years the sidewalk allocation from the capital plan. But on closer examination that probably doesn't work because that means no other sidewalk will be repaired anywhere in town for five years and there are far too many pieces in seriously bad condition.
Authored by: spoon on Wednesday, May 06 2009 @ 10:48 PM GMT+4
Then we have the issue of credit, loans etc. We have been fortunate in recent years not to have had a spate of expensive exceptional costs and have held to a fairly modest debt burden. With this in mind the Selectboard just foisted the precedent-setting decision to borrow for paving. $800,000 dollars worth. We are now also voting on a 32 million dollar loan for the wastewater plant. Tho that is guaranteed by utility bills rather than taxes it is still aggregated in our total debt burden in determining eligibility and rates of interest from bonding companies. Now we are talking about throwing on another $300,000 for sidewalks. Suppose next year we discover that the filtration plant or sewer pipes need a quick million or two in repairs? Or the poorly built Academy school needs major work. Or the municipal building. And if I'm not mistaken we have a 6 million dollar police station in the capital plan for the year after next.
One has to wonder what concept of the future is in the minds of our Selectboard. Or if they have a concept at all.
I challenge the Selectboard to share with the citizens their picture of our financial situation in ten years (can they even do 5?) and explain how they arrived at it.
Authored by: SpudHill on Thursday, May 07 2009 @ 06:12 AM GMT+4
Spoon...after re-reading your post are you saying that it's a $1.5 million project just to do the sidewalks on Main Street downtown?
Seems to me that we need a Selectboard with a larger dose of good old Yankee ingenuity. You'd think considering the economic state of the country that they'd realize that borrow and spend approaches are just trouble down the road. I don't get it....
In New York when they added wheelchairs ramps to the curbs by the way they didn't just redo all the sidewalks in New York, they redid them at the corners where they were needed by drilling out a block of paver and reinserting a new one with a built-in graduation. How many would we need to do downtown...about 10 or 12 at the most I would guess.
I'm just baffled by this SB's approach to town finances in this current economic climate. Although I'm not aware of any of their personal backgrounds I'm certainly beginning to suspect that they all are considerably more wealthy than the average taxpayer and am beginning to also suspect that most of them must have inherited income because they seem to have very little judgment when it comes to fiscal policy.
Well, it's only $70 a year more here, $90 a year more there, what's another $160 per household...seems to be the approach.
Authored by: KM on Thursday, May 07 2009 @ 01:13 PM GMT+4
Do any of these sidewalks have cross-slopes over 2% (essentially flat) - I think so. I don't know the project specifically, but I suspect that the ADA deficiencies are throughout. Piecemeal repairs will be FULLY funded by Brattleboro. Is the suggestion to spend $100K/year from Brattleboro funds versus spending $300K Brattleboro funds to leverage $1.2m state/federal funds to get it done once and forall for the next 25 years? When you're using state and federal funds there are a LOT of stipulations required (primarily put there by progressive forces mind you). Given the challenges in Brattleboro, these numbers don't surprise me. KEY POINT: I'm overjoyed that Brattleboro is progressive enough to spend money on "just" pedestrians. Where should we spend the transportation dollars on making the roads smoother for the vehicles and higher speeds!
Authored by: SpudHill on Thursday, May 07 2009 @ 01:47 PM GMT+4
I never said Just Pedestrians...who did? I'm also a pedestrian at most times.
But it seems silly to spend money just because you THINK you may get federal/state funds to work on a project.
And where are you picking out that $100,000 figure...because it seems to me that the crosswalk areas could and should be done at a fraction of that price. I would think we're talking maybe $10 or $20,000 as opposed to $300,000. It's silly to be thinking well it's just $60 or $70 dollars per taxpayer here and then $60 or $70 per taxpayer to do this and then $20 per taxpayer to do that...that's how you end up in big financial trouble with such huge tax burdens that people start getting behind. You be amazed at how quickly $60 here or there can add up to enough to hurt the average guy.
If you could do the things that are definitely needed like sloped access at intersections for wheelchair access a fraction of the price it seems to be much more sensible and favorable to the taxpayers. You shouldn't just be spending money to spend money in this economic environment. Do what has to be done and should be done and that's it.
Authored by: spoon on Thursday, May 07 2009 @ 03:42 PM GMT+4
1) There has been no mention of standards for Brattleboro sidewalks and where exactly are the places that fall short and to what extent. (Sound a bit familiar, Kevin?) General observation suggests that only 50 or a 100 thousand may be more than adequate to bring the sidewalks up to par. This is FAR short of the 1.5 MILLION proposed.
2) The budget for sidewalks indicated in our capital plan is 50,000 for this year and increasing by several thousand each year for the next 5.
3) If there has been any planning or forethought given to this project it has not come to my attention. Among other things I would want, if it were to be done at all, is our own public works and local engineering companies to do ALL the work. All the money we can keep in this town must be kept here.
4) If it were to be done at all it would be a perfect time to eliminate one full lane (one side of parking) and widen the sidewalks on at least one if not both sides. This would go a long way to making it pedestrian friendlier. Buffers from traffic can be accomplished with planters.
5) Rebuild them now for the next 25 years!? The sidewalks we have now are probably good for 30 or 40 more years. I've been ambling up and down Main St for over 20 years now and can't think of one piece that has been rebuilt in all that time. Nor can I think of one piece that is in any worse shape now than it was 20 years ago. (OK, I can think of one piece rebuilt. By the garage. But it wasn't done because the pre-existing sidewalks were in bad shape).
Authored by: annikee on Thursday, May 07 2009 @ 08:28 PM GMT+4
New sidewalks were put in by and over the Main St / Kyle Gilbert Bridge. Also around part of Pliny Park. And some parts of Elliot. Spoon has a valid point; the existing sidewalks are not the mess you find elsewhere and have plenty of years left in them. Spud's also right, to my mind, in that the accessability points are what's needed, not much else. I am on 4 wheels part time, soon to be full time. I am thinking this is all for esthetics, so the town looks all pretty and shiny; new roads, new sidewalks, new taxes. So much for fiscal conservation.
