A possibly short meeting with potentially interesting topics ahead was actually not so short due to technical difficulties, but it certainly was interesting. A respite from budgets, for sure.
Sustainability, food security, downtown safety, bridge fixing, and more were all discussed. Some with slide presentations!
Preliminaries
BCTV has lots of great shots of no one at the desk. Off at the site visit?
They start arriving at 6:17. The Town Manager is there. Liz is there. Fish came, then went.
Ian shows up at 6:19 as does Daniel.
Fish come back by 6:20. And then Franz arrives.
Chair Ian Goodnow – I think the interpreters need to be bigger. Maybe pinning them is the way to do it? Cor said not to pin them? BCTV is it alright for them to be so small? Usually we share the box with them. (mumbles from bctv). Ahh, thank you BCTV. I have a couple of remarks this evening. Absentee ballots are available y request and will get ailed out next week. Go tot he my voter page or call the Town Clerk. The presidential primary requires you to request a ballot for Democrats or Republicans. If anyone wants to run as write in – declare your intent to run by election day. Functionally, you can decide the day or, make sure you tell Hillary before the ned of the day. If not, it won’t count because you were not official. Thanks to Seth Thomas for pushing out election info.
Town Manager John Potter – A few comments. The Winter Carnival kicks off. Town has a new online dog licensing portal. All dog owners were notified. Businesses will get business license renewals and there is a new portal for that as well, or call the Assessors office. Both are part of the new system with open gov software. The library has covid test kits.
Peter Case – I licensed my dog – the 13th one! – pending approval. It was easy to do.
Daniel Quipp – next Thursday the Charter Review Commission will meet here to discuss representative town meeting and if it is the right form of government for Brattleboro – if you have an opinion turn up.
Franz Reichsman – people may want to know that on the 22nd of this month BCTV will record a candidates forum. Three of us for one year seat and two for the three year seat and all will be invited to participate. Learn more about candidates. It will happen right here.
Peter – attend in person.
Franz – from 6-8 pm, with two events.
Peter – put together by the Commons
Franz – and the Reformer and BCTV and maybe even someone else.
Public Participation
no one
Consent Agenda
A. Assessor’s Office Certificate of No Appeal – Accept
B. VTrans Certificate of Highway Mileage – Accept
C. Vermont Downtown Program Grant Application – Approve
D. Winston Prouty Center for Child and Family Development, Limited Event Permit for Bingo Fundraiser – Approve
so consented
Dettman Drive Public Hearing
Ian – opening the public hearing formally. The Town of Brattleboro Selectboard will accept a class 3 highway known as Dettman Drive. Town notified the private road, and abutters of a site visit that we did today and the hearing tonight. We also posted the public notice. We had the site visit and the board members and other parties and members of the public attended. We toured the bridge and Dettman Drive and the other bridge that accesses the area. Took 30 minutes. Now it is the public hearing to see if we should accept it as a town road. Formally opening the hearing to the public first. Happy to take questions.
No public comments.
Selectboard…
Liz McCloughlin – an overview of the steps and timeframe?
Dan Ridlehoover – how long and the steps? At the previous public meeting in January there was a memo of understanding for the transition of ownership from Sri-Park, then how we jointly replace both bridges. If the town owns the bridge, we can get state and federal grants that private owners cannot. TriPark could contribute to the town’s bridge more easily than funding it all themselves. I don’t know the timelines. If the board accepts things tonight, there is a 60 day appeal period, then the transaction could occur. The parcel would be surveyed. It would get wider at that width at the end for a truck turnaround.
Peter – I appreciated so far the pace at which we’ve been moving to rectify this situation. This is an urgent need. Let’s keep the pace up. It feels good. It feels right.
Ian – I echo that. I appreciate the board working to get this done. We’ll do this as quickly as safely possible. Board? Public?
Board moves to lay out and establish Dettman Drive as a class 3 highway to a point north of the bridge, at the hammerhead turnaround.
5-0
Security Services and Town Safety Update
Ian – I’ll invite the Chief and Assistant Chief up…
Chief Norma Hardy and Assistant Chief Jeremy Evans
Ian – when we first did the security services we asked for an update from the police on how things have been going, so this is just to hear from you all.
Evans – things have been steadily going on at the parking garage. We get good positive feedback about the presence in it. Looked at our call volume over the same time frame last year – Oct to January – not a lot of data but the volume of our calls is about the same but we saw change in the type of calls – less vandalism and thefts, and more medical responses and substance abuses.
Ian – can you speak to other town facilities?
Evans – we started staffing a roving security officer – lots of positive feedback. Library especially happy about it.
Ian – board?
Franz – So, I’m in terms of the numbers of calls you are getting, is that more what is happening, ro more the reports of what is happening. Before calls were all from citizens, but some calls now come from security personnel, so it is a different reporting mechanism. Does this mean there are more medical emergencies or we are reporting them better?
Hardy – we have a person there with direct access. The idea was to have more eyes and ears – we are catching things as they happen. We provide a phone to security. They call when they witness something. So more calls. But having a person there means violence, vandalism and theft has decreased.
Franz – one way to assemble the numbers is to say it has been successful in addressing some of the more dire events.
Hardy – we feel confident that is what is happening and it has made a difference having a uniformed person there. We can’t cover it al the time, but you get an idea of how the numbers have changed.
Evans – medical emergencies are for the police department responding – it is what we responded to. Two things I saw – in 2022 we had 22 calls from public for suspicious people in the garage. In 2023 we had 7. Calls went down drastically. Thefts did the same thing , from 8 to 2. So having someone there is helping us. Public say they are more comfortable in the facility.
Peter Case – we saw a 65% drop, 22 vs 7. One thing when we presented the idea, that is what we were thinking of. Put someone there to report things. A nice bonus is that they are also there is someone is having a medical emergency. I wasn’t thinking that when we set this up.
Hardy – having someone there means people can say they aren’t feeling well and can get help.
Liz – a goal for the year was to have the Transportation Center function properly as a parking garage… is it being better utilized?
Potter – I think permits are increasing. Renewals happen soon so we’ll know better.
Liz – people feel more secure so I would think tat would lead to more usage.
Potter – police have done a great job, but also DPW. They do extra cleaning and attention to detail.
Daniel – thanks for the presentation. We are driving down criminal activity and increasing responses to medical emergencies. Future reports could talk about the community resource person, and your thoughts on that position.
Franz – my next question revolves around the future – the plan to have private officers replace the security persons. In this context, do you have a target date to continue with security personnel?
Hardy – when we first came we saw it as a stopgap, we talked about the time it takes to have one officer come out and work. If you look at two police academy a year, a candidate has to go for 17 weeks and make it, and if they do they come back and be trained with a training officer for 12 weeks. That much time they aren’t an officer. We have some not make it through he training because we are tough. We’ve lost people at the Academy and we’ve lost people in our training. It could be half of all we lose.
Franz – we have 7 starting right now. Say they all go through and 29 weeks means October or November… where would they go?
Hardy – we’d be just about at full strength. Someone might retire or go somewhere else, but… that’s our hope and a best case. If that happened, then we would be able to have full downtown coverage with uniformed police officers.
Potter – so, Hardy and Evans and HR Dept Nix have been focused on recruits. having 7 going tot he Academy must be some sort of a record. They did really well and have more for the summer academy.
Liz – There will be a community resource discussion at some other time, but you might replace that persona nd that goes into the overall personnel mix. Have you found that the community resource specialist is helpful and want it to continue?
Hardy – yes. Very positive feedback from businesses downtown, walking around, talking to the public, helping with resources. We’ve had good people in the position.
Frank – when people didn’t make it, what happens?
Hardy – some people don’t make it through the strenuous Academy training – hard workouts and studying. Once here, we have intense training so they can be the best. Some don’t make it through our training. It is detail oriented. Anyone else – we have a young force now. People may decide to go elsewhere. And my assistant chief reminds me, before we send someone to the academy, a background check might cause us to lose them.
Evans – we lost half on background checks…
Ingrid – I’m curious about criteria for selecting candidates for academy training.
Hardy – when we pick someone, we have an application, we do a screening by video, we’ll ask questions. If they pass, they come and meet with the oral board to answer a slew of questions. During that day they have questions, plus a ride-along to understand what their day consists of, plus a psychological evaluation. We also do a preliminary physical exam to help them prepare for the academy.
Evans – once we offer a pending job, we ask specific personal questions, such as medical data, and a polygraph exam, plus a psych exam and a physical exam. We assign a detective to each person. Took a lot of time this year. We got lucky, and got some more local interest recently. Detectives meet with past employee, references, and others to get as much info as possible. Strong moral compass, solid decision making, core values, and so on… that process is usually a couple months long and half don’t make it. Once they get through they go to the police academy.
Ian – probably coming bak in the fall when we have a change in number of officers would be good for next steps. Happy to know it is going well. Is the service working out? Any issues with them?
Hardy – no – we work very well with them and the people that are here in town.
Sustainability Program Update
Ian – I invite our sustainability coordinator to the presentation table.
Stephen Dotson – I have some slides. It’s a been a while since I was…
(Jess … I don’t have it cued up…)
Dotson – I can walk you through it without it being on screen
Ian – five minute recess!
Sustainability, The (Much) Longer Version
Ian – we good to go? We’re back.
Dotson – I hadn’t spoken to you for a while. This will be work to date.
Ian – we can do questions at the end…
Ian – do we still have BCTV?
Case – 5 minute recess?
Ian – let’s keep it like this and go through the slides.
Dotson – this position was created in 2019 and I started in 2020. The Town defined to job broadly, similar to the United Nations. I’ve used “straving to make Brattleboro more livable to longer for everyone” as the slogan. There are projects for the Town and the town.
Dotson – the energy committee – bike library, investment in cow power, setting climate goals, and creation of global warming fund. The committee stayed bus – doing window inserts to keep people warmer. HatcSpace wants to partner and do more of them here. In the future we will work on Town Plan and map toward decarbonization, more batteries, a community wood bank, and a community bike project. There is a GMP grid scale battery for TriPark, too, maybe. Efficiency Vermont collaboration has been a big focus of the committee. We got a focused community action plan of 18 months – very effective campaign (energy kits, mailings, coupons, etc.). Six municipal building to 100% LED lighting, too. Our efficiency is up but our emissions are also up – upcoming work at living memorial park will be significant. Cow power helped. LED lighting helps. Electric landscaping equipment helps. Gibson Aiken had an energy audit and they’ll get $500k in improvements from state funds. Insulation, replacing oil system, and replacing heating controls to be zoned. We will upgrade heating control at Central Fire and adding EV charging stations, and upgrades to the Waste Water Treatment Plant we are looking at. Then a comprehensive inventory of greenhouse gasses, once the state comes up with a standard. Our first step is to do building level monitoring and management. We’re trying to monitor without being on site, so we can make immediate adjustments. That will require remotely accessible heating controls and a Dept of Energy program to measure your buildings and see how you compare to other towns and cities. We need to phase out fossil fuel heating, transition to electric vehicles, build and rebuild buildings to high energy standards, our standards must rise in procurement. The obstacles are sunken assets, uncertainty about future ownership of buildings, unproven technology, and additional work triggered by energy upgrades unrelated, such as health and safety issues that arise. Why aren’t we doing solar? We are maxed out on net metering credits – we’re obligated to buy from the grid. We can’t put panels on our roofs. As demand for electricity goes up and the gap widens renewables could be used, but we’d need the space to put it, or do small level solar on roofs and put it into batteries for emergencies or car charging. Also looking at micro hydro and other technologies…
Dotson – The Global Warming Solutions Fund – balance is $74k. We’ve spent it on ice rink natural refrigeration upgrades, electrifying landscaping equipment and LED lighting (which will pay for itself in 4 years). Expenditures will go to those future projects in the future. The fun allows me to go after lots of other funding and grants.
Dotson – Active Transportation – a new web page will give info, we have the e-bike lending library, more bike projects, more EV charging stations on town properties and a working group for anyone with parking lots (about 15)
Franz – could those charging stations be connected to solar energy sources? I bought an electric vehicle and if it was cashless and down with solar without any interface, I’d love to see it.
Dotson – when you draw from the grid it better because GMP’s power is carbon neutral. Bike and car share aspirations – too small for a bigger business to offer it so it would have to be local, and continued work on trails and connections.
Dotson – Conservation and Trails – we got a grant to look at and connect different trails – Winston Prouty/Delta, Retreat Farm and Hole Trails, CR Rail Trail not feasible, trail counters with WRC, and grants. UNH and Fort Hill connections, and in the future the Whetstone path planning, Brattleboro Trail Crew, West River Corridor assists, 250 Birge Street redevelopment, more grants and more community partners…
the sound cuts out…
the interpreter is just sitting and waiting like the rest of us…
the picture restarts and farm and food assessment slide show appears
now the sound comes back and everyone is chatting like it is a cocktail party. “Were you around.? 150 bikes.. pretty insane! All the bikes, without helmets. I just got an email…”
the sound cuts out again
the slideshow resets to Active Transportation.
you can see the cocktail party going on, but cannot hear it
it seems like there might be another “Five Minute Break” going on, but we at home have no idea. Just them milling about with the sound off. (5 minutes from now will be time for the regular 8 o’clock five minute break. : ) )
Dotson – Ag has had a lot of work – we’ve done campaigns to grow food, cook, food, make tools and seeds available , the ag advisory committee was revived then on hiatus, the crop mob. 805 Western Ave is a parcel owned by the town and it is a permaculture food forest with Edible Brattleboro.
Dotson – Brooks Memorial has been helping support local non-profits, such as a grant database. It helps me , too, work with local businesses and organizations. The last category is other things I work on in town – wastewater sludge, road salt alternatives such as beet or pickle juice, drought resistance for farmers, and we need to do asbestos removal at Brooks Memorial and it looks especially expensive to address.
Ian – can you bring down the frost presentation. Now it isn’t up at all.
Case – Five minutes…
Franz – not showing on zoom in the real world…
Ian – if you can go back tot he nonprofit one, people at home it is the third to last page of the presentation in the backup materials on the website.
Jess – I’m not sure..
Ian – bring it up for us and it isn’t working for zoom.
Stephen – here are the resources I brought – Americorps volunteer, $155k in hand, and up to $500k at Gibson Aiken, so my final slide is a thank you and a lot of my work is coordinating. I wrangle amazing energy in the community. Grateful to have the job.
Ian – board ?
Liz – couple of comments – the Moover – are you coordinating bus transportation goals? How is that going?
Ian – the new website lays out the schedules, the bus, the app for the bus, making connections. We’re trying to make it more accessible.
Liz – on conservation trail – the downtown design plan with open space linkages, I would hope that would be part of your roster of plans. Nice little alternative routes to walk downtown…
Dotson – sure.
Liz – in addition to the energy savings, the electric appliances are really important to health of the operator, in addition to energy savings. And lastly the food farms consultant is below the threshold for selctboard approval. (yes)
Franz – I was expecting to say there was a lack of focus, but hearing it all it sounds like you have a wide ranging selection of subjects to have an impact on and they are going well.
Ian – me, then the public. Thanks for the report, and everytime you come before the board… EV charging stations… will they be for the public?
Dotson – the ones now are for public use but will install some for dedicated use at our facilities.
Ian – FT Hill is in NH, across from Walmart?
Dotson – a little further down.
Ian – 805 Western…
Sue Fillion – a FEMA flood buyout. We own the pottery. It can’t be built on. Just west of former Diamandstone property.
Ian – the grant for Gibson Aiken is great – I commend it. If there are other grants we encourage them, too.
Dotson – and kudos to Carol Lollatte..
Ian – no public? Okay, thanks for all the hard work…
Food/Farm System Assessment Update
Carissa Brewton and Emma Bliss
Ian – welcome..
Dotson – this is a preliminary results and themes of a project by the ag advisory committee and their work with other groups. We looked at food insecurity, and took a comprehensive look at it. Got input from the key stakeholders, then we had to find a way to pay for it. Two locals were working on food policy at law school. It is under $10k. Grateful for people who knew the community… and here are some results. Final report in March.
Emma – I’m a Vermont local, a farm owner.
Clarissa – I focus on food security and nutrition and health
Emma – an overview and some findings tonight. The purpose was to shift the focus to long term resiliency – how can we meet the needs of the community and the people working in it. We wanted to look holistically, looking for gaps, and highlighting work already going on. The document is a snapshot of this sector at this time, and we provide some recommendations. They can be a starting pint for collaboration.
Clarissa – it reflects desires already in the community. The structure and timeline – we’ve been doing this for about a year, starting with data and policy. The intention was to bring in stakeholders from the beginning, we had conversations, asked what they wanted out of this project, and we continue that communication. Wanted to stay grounded in what the people on ground want to see here. We gathered info from 19 organizations, also did a look at food relevant laws and policies from local to federal, surveyed the community at farmers market and surveys, and more. Planning Dept helps.
Emma – these are these repeated over and over, so this is a selection. There are 15 that came out of this. From producers to restaurants…
Clarissa – first two themes and recommendations: 1. Impactful collaboration across sectors, with more joint projects and need for more capacity to do collaboration. This leads to a recommendation of a Food Systems Coordinator – help with communication and projects. 2. Local Food for Local Eaters, there is a high volume of food access programs with local foods, interest in more engagement by farmers, but barriers to physical access – transportation. The recommendation is to improve public transit to food points, like farm stands, farmers market, and CSAs.
Emma – 3. there is an infrastructure need – not enough kitchen space for prep, or pickup…- we think there is a need for a multipurpose food systems space. Could have a commercial kitchen. Recommendation: Build resilience through diverse markets – support access to regional markets and build relationships , and have a local food website/database. We tap into agri-toursim, but there are local community eaters, but they need out of state income. It would be for community members but also tell the story of the Brattleboro food story. Producers need help telling the story of the food system in Brattleboro. 4. Climate disruption was a big one – producers feel effects then it ripples down to eaters. Producers needed to adapt and invest, and it is expensive. There is a need for support for climate impacts.
Clarissa – schools feel the impacts – the youngest people int he community. Farm to School is great here and should spread. There are three prongs – schools have a regular schedule – a reliable local market to sell to. There is the nutrition for kids and the federal reimbursement for nutritious food. And there is the education opportunity to educate and engage young eaters with their food and where it comes from, so they can be informed eaters. Some kids are on farms.
Emma – the last item is labor shortage – low population density, lack of young people to work, hard to provide competitive wages – need more investigation into labor security. At numerous points we stopped ourselves from going down other rabbit holes – the labor is a concern.
Clarissa – the dumb of volunteers, and making it bigger/better… the generosity of time is uplifting.
Emma – there are many more themes and we’ll release it in March. We’re pretty far in the process. Thanks for having us.
Ian – will you come back with the final?
Emma – if you have time…
Sue – haven’t discussed it.
Liz – will you explore programs and resources at federal and state level? There might be solutions within the Ag programs…
Emma – we started with law and policy because of that, to see what was going on and what impacts it would have. One theme is that some of Vermont – we’re in a bit of an island for some state programs – we’re in a blind spot. We’re considered part of Mass, so we don’t get the same attention. Statehouse Conner in Brattleboro is limited.
Clarrisa – federal programs are for large farms in Iowa… there are many layers of barriers.
Liz – maybe we should bring up these issues with our VT delegation.
Clarissa – they know about this and expect to see it.
Ian – other board members? Franz?
Franz – thanks for doing us tonight. A number of points require financing. Where will the money come from.
Emma – this is a resource for future planning.
Franz – someone else can deal with it. That’s okay.
Clarissa – we are trying to foster collaboration and administrative coordination and doesn’t have to come from the town budget.
Franz – the coordinator will take some funds. It occurred to me and wondered how it would develop.
Emma – there were some organizations that were thinking of it, to get a grant and house it within their walls. This isn’t 20 things for the town to do, just things that came up and we want to talk about with the whole community. Clear outcomes and needs.
Dotson – the food system is a regional entity. It wouldn’t be appropriate for Brattleboro to take the lead. To be explicit clear. Someone more regional.
Franz – good luck.
ian – Interested in the final report. My only questions are the specifics – a farmers market downtown is very interesting, in addition to the weekend on? Was the need or interest to have it on a weekday?
Clarrisa- the summer market is great, serves tourists and SNAP – something downtown and midweek would be less busy and easier.
Ian – I had a similar thought on my own.
Emma – the farmers market is important for revenue – to have another platform is great.
Franz – used to be a Wednesday downtown market.
Ingrid – we’ve been members for 17 years and we’re totally dedicated to this market. We had a midweek market in town and got moved around. NEYT parking lot, Coop parking lot, and the Rivergarden – none were very successful for us. Haven’t figured out why. The winter market is a different organization, doing very well, at Austine. Since we are part of MA, go after them for more funds… : )
Ian – the CSA pickup – was the need to have one place for multiple CSA’s…
Emma – there are lots of places and coordination right now. The feeling is that having one place would be much easier.
Ian – public? Okay thanks..
Vacant Building Ordinance
Potter – the staff here about vacant properties over and over and were asked to look into what can be done. We want to get a sense from the board to see whether you want further research or if you want us to come back with a draft ordinance or just table it for now..get a feel from you and where you are. Steve and Sue can help us drill down into the research we’ve down so far. Steve Hayes looked at 10 towns and their ordinances, and VLCT’s model ordinance didn’t have any penalty or tax. Some have tried to do that by imposing registration fee – a vacant building registry fee. happy to tell you about other towns or just get repose to our questions.
Hayes – happy to take questions.
Ian – we have three questions and we should give clarity to town staff. Any general comments or questions?
Liz – is there a standard for how a vacant property is maintained – how it gets boarded up and severed…
Hayes – properties need to be secured against unsafe conditions. Owners need to prevent unwarranted access that would cause a danger.
Liz – is there something now or proposed that a building alerts us if it becomes vacant.
Sue Fillion – you could have that in an oridinance to notify the town.
Liz – but probably nothing to prod vacant building owners, like demolish…
Sue – nothing to cause it. You’d need a health order
Liz – or structural stability.
Hayes – some communities compel it for public nuisance as they define it, beyond health or structural.
Liz – I’m generally instructed in some of these topics.
Peter – my question is – the vacant Friendly’s property – how did that get cleaned up?
Sue – Brain Bannon contracted them and pressured them to clean it up, demolish it… the poetry got a new owner recently. there is constant communication with property owners to let them know we have housing needs.
Peter – the clean up is the new owner, wanting to stay in good grace with the town.
Sue – the property is being marketed…
Peter – who wants a shrub with a building in the middle of it. It’s good to pressure them to keep things presentable.
Ian – every one of the ways a vacant property can damage the town, I’d like to address with an ordinance. VCLT has helped draft them and we can edit it… is that our next step to have them draft one and we add additional language? I see no reason to delay, especially if they already have done this work. You identified some of these as cities vs towns… does that matter?
Hayes – it is the case for Burlington and Rutland – they can do things charters wouldn’t allow otherwise without charter amendments. Burlington can even assess taxes.
Ian – in reviewing it, there are all sorts of ways to address it. Let’s keep it as broad as possible to address as much as we can. Not sure if that is legally sound. Not sure if these get challenged. Maybe VLCT can help us.
Peter – why do this? There are several reasons – public safety at the top of the list.
Ian – that’s one, lost municipal revenue is another. Vacant or underused properties aren’t good for the town.
Liz – it is blight. It should be broad so you don’t target a single property.
Daniel – when I read the memo I wasn’t really excited about it, but upon reflection, there seems like enough support to see what we can legally do, and we could contact the communities that have them and learn from them, and set our goal. What is our goal? In regards to a housing shortage – any impeding buildings are a major problem. And commercial properties sitting empty that could be commercial. Someone bought the old shrub building for a commercial intention. I’d be incline to support housing in abandoned units.
Peter – Sporty’s, old Home Depot – they are falling in on themselves. We need to incentivize people to make moves on it. That advances the conversation. It’s not a good look for the town.
Liz – the Charter – if we pursue this we want to be able to change the charter, we should add it to the charter change committee.
…
That does it for me. (They’re going to amend some contracts, pay more money, and ask for committee volunteers.)
Hayes – nothing seemed to need it…
Liz – they are fining…
Hayes – they aren’t doing anything outside of what we would do but they can enact additional enforcement.
Ian – I hear the incentives – having some enforcement that we could have and we haven’t chosen to do it. We should use every tool at our disposal. The urgency is why aren’t we just doing this?
Daniel – I’d ask for legal review of this, and looking at other communities – can we do all the things they are doing? And yeah, a substantial carrot and stick, so long as we can back it up.
Franz – I’m echoing what I hear from others – what’s the most we can do and a list we can choose from. I’d like to know what is possible. get in touch with other towns to learn about pitfalls or successes. I’d like to hear what helped.
Daniel – the goal is to have new commercial and residential activity, so if towns say that didn’t happen, I’d like to hear that.
Peter – and would it work here and be rolled out properly – just because it didn’t;t work for others doesn’t mean it might not work for us.
ian – a broad draft ordinance to address blight and underutilized properties – could that all be addressed in a broad way, and show us all the options, and then we could just knock some out if we don’t want ti.
Peter -we know our town best and can apply it to our town.