Yeah I think I’be been ‘pushed around’ on iBrattleboro just a bit. And I have definitely spoken out quite a bit — and been taken to task for — questioning why people on iBrattleboro would want to debate serious issues under pseudonyms … and especially why they might expect to do so and still be taken seriously. It particularly irked me recently when someone criticized a Town employee by name on this site, but declined to give their own!
Anonymous or pseudonymous postings may be appropriate in a few cases, but where it gets out of hand … watch out! Check this article about a smartphone app that has caused real problems because of people not posting under their own names, and therefore not being held responsible for some seroius harassment!
Article Link
John, I have been fighting
John,
I have been fighting this battle for years with these gutless snipers. Sve your time and energy. They don’t have the courage to stand behind their own opinions. That is sad.
Bob Fagelson
The Lost Art of Sniper Shot Opinions
While the trend is to force an ID to register your comments, there is something lost along the way. The ID enforcement, of course, narrowed the field considerably. In addition, sometimes it’s easier to say exactly how you feel behind the shades of anonymity.
It wasn’t that all these opinions were worthless or inaccurate; it’s just that the sting was more important to the authors than revealing who they were. Moreover, the opinions were so well placed that the ID of the authors were irrelevant. Indeed, oftentimes these gutless snips were entertaining, snarky, stick-it-to-em parlances that you don’t find as much anymore.
Also, the notion that these sniper shot opinions were slung at one because the slingers didn’t “have the courage to stand behind their own opinions” is not entirely true.
While having been a victim myself, I consider this trend to put a face on it as part of a grievous lost art.
Perhaps eye scanning technology would be more suitable to those who wilt under the glare of this genre of “seroius harassment!”
I wrote a weekly column in
I wrote a weekly column in the Reformer for more than 13 years. I got into a lot of controversy and received some nasty comments. Here are a few:
“Degrading and contemptuous”
“Guided missile of bigotry and hatefulness”
“Enormously offensive”
As the wife of a practicing doctor in town, my wife would often be concerned about the effect my columns would have on my practice. I know for a fact that some people refused to see me professionally because of my stated opinions. But you know what? I’m still here. Furthermore, no matter what these folks had to say about me, they at least had the courage and decency to sign their letters.
It’s sad that this anonymous sniping continues. Our society is rapidly becoming one in which we are all demanding our rights, but are not willing to accept the responsibilities that go with these rights.
Bob Fagelson
The old time-honored two-word retort
Since your name in the Reformer is one that will attract my attention, (sorry, not everyone does but I will try to read them nevertheless) I can’t see what the fuss is about over your comments, as described above. I agree more often than not with your opinion (my rating of John takes a bit of a dip there on philosophical matters…)
As a long term opinion maker I’m no stranger to controversy or nasty comments, but my social and philosophical separation-booster broke away from mainstream thrusters long before I was 25. When it comes to the nameless only heavy libelous or threaten comments might stir my pot but even then I can always call up the old time-honored two-word retort, if I can get it into print…
~Vidda Crochetta
Well, Vidda, you are one of
Well, Vidda, you are one of those people who actually can tell the difference between a “libelous” statement, “defamation of character” and a personal opinion even when it’s written using only a first initial and a full last name or any other screen name. There appears to be a scarcity of that ability.
Content and Context
In my opinion, you good gentleman should spend your moral outrage on subjects worthy of your ire. We are practically drowning in horrors these days, so it won’t be difficult to find causes your energies might ameliorate. Cyber bullying certainly is among these problems. I wish that were the focus of this missive, rather than continuing to try inveigling or browbeating for posters’ names to satisfy your discomfort.
As an example of context, in a surf lineup, when you arrive at a new break, and you are not known to anyone, nor do you know anyone..the protocol is very much to do what you do, and show yourself as you are. Your behavior and skills and demeanor speak volumes, without ambiguity. Are you patient, or greedy for waves? Are you new to the sport, or an old dog? All anyone needs to know is revealed almost immediately. The real name thing rarely even comes up.
Or, for another example, since you brought it up, doesn’t your wife run the wonderful secret santa program in town? Surely you can see the reasons for anonymity in that case. Could you not grant that kindness and generosity might come from people who remain unnamed?
Shocking!
It is quite sad to hear that Robert Fagelson experienced such unkindness.
During his tenure as Chairman of the Brattleboro Selectboard, Dr. Fagelson created an environment in which everyone coming before the Board experienced a memorable welcome. Understanding the value of hearing diverse opinions, he made a point of extending particular courtesies to people with whom he disagreed.
Losing Battle
Give it up, John. You’re fighting a losing battle.
Personally taking part in
Having personally taken part in various debates on local issues or just when offering a general reaction to interesting events and information supplied here over the past years, I see as a much appreciated privilege created very generously by the creators of the ibrattleboro web site. It has opened up channels for an assortment of communication/commentary wide enough to capture the feelings/opinions of the entire community and allows all-comers with an interest, however intense, to participate that would never have occurred to this degree otherwise.
This broadened opportunity to speak out would quickly be stifled and compromised if restricted. This is especially true if certain so called enlightened forces went ahead and insisted drastic, presumptive measures take place to supposedly level the playing field by only permitting full name users to comment. This could end up concentrating on all those self proclaimed politically correct intellectuals with a full name to dominate free expression on this site and by process of elimination constrict all those who have a somewhat guarded opinion, do not wish to throw their actual name tag for which it stands in the ring for whatever their personal reason to express only a certain facet of their personality that may not be representative of the whole reputation at stake. Some members of our community, newcomers and alike may not happen to stand in the same places or possess prominent stature here in town where instead their voices can be less significant or common place compared to a very recognized authority that can drown them out in a slight condescending fashion of an expert.
Whether the occasional contributor happens to abuse this privilege by means of a reckless written delivery using harsh statements or careless unfound innuendo behind a pen name in a heated exchange ill directed at individuals or mostly their ideas and ideals, this action can not be blamed solely on one’s choice of anonymity, as if serving as a protective shield, that supposedly makes that all possible, although I won’t say it doesn’t happen. I find the majority of earnest comments to be rational and respectful here.
In a debate, it is rather the obligation of those who initiated/ promote certain claims and opinions in posts, (yet are right off the first to be astonished or offended by counter remarks that strike a nerve and turn their logic upside down,) to defend their opinions with sound fact that if is conclusively supportive of their assertions, will puts any stray comments in check or in their rightful place discredited and more importantly isolate those to be stand corrected, only making the “out of line” name slayer appear the fool.
Chris and Lise have provided a “marked offensive” check box option” when a response is blatantly disrespectful, inappropriately personal or outlandish and can be omitted if need be and this helps discourage this kind of behavior I would hope. I think the point that others may be less likely to speak up unless they can remain anonymous has a lot of credence attached to it, but still could remain a thorn in the side of those more self righteous individuals who can’t counter criticism with tact that is hopefully constructive but not necessarily. In reality, I can name the real identity of most of those who have been consistent contributors on ibrattleboro and choose to be anonymous, it changes nothing for how I happen to respond when I do feel compelled to do so and I respect their decision.
And who are you?
You may disagree with John, but he is far from alone on this issue. Maybe it is a generational thing. I was raised to say what you mean, mean what you say, and then sign your name. As I look around the internet I see tons of pointless anonymous remarks. I appreciate John posting the link about the “after school app”. If we want the next generation to take responsibility and not hide behind fake names maybe we need to show a different way. Just wondering…
Andy Davis
John Hancock
Not everyone aspires to be a John Hancock.
In the glut of humanity names are becoming rather pointless no matter what they say. But it can be said that there are many anonymous postings which are not pointless but in fact are rather to the point.
This issue of anonymity has strong emotional overtones, yet, I’ve never heard anyone complain about anonymous postings that are glowing or supportive.
Here on iBrattleboro a good many people use a pseudonym. In literature and public life pseudonyms are a dynamic of self-identity. I wouldn’t want to see sign-offs become homogenized because some people are negatively impacted by anonymous comments.
Are names 'rather pointless' ?
As a teacher I see the importance of children learning to say and write their names. It is both an achievement in young lives and an effort for many. A name on a piece of writing matters. A signature still has moral, legal and financial significance. None of that is ‘pointless’. Colleges struggle with plagiarism in the internet age because it is so easy to copy the ideas of others. Is IP address replacing who we really are?
I don’t think anyone is complaining about anonymous acts and words of kindness and insight. These have always existed in the world from may baskets and secret santas to corporate whistle blowers who struggle to protect themselves from retaliation. But the issue is the tidal wave of unthinking meanness that has infected the servers of the world.
Yes, iBrattleboro is a very friendly place for the most part. I have been called names on this site by anonymous posters and survived. Maybe they were right but I never knew the source.
Andy
Taken with a Grain of Salt
There are “tons (tidal waves) of pointless anonymous remarks“ who would beg to differ with you.
A name “on a piece of writing matters“ when the writer wants it to matter. Without a name, it is a matter of content. Yet, very few posts are concerned with “moral, legal and financial significance.“
Anonymity only extends to the reader. But, IP addresses are indeed a tracking device. Real slander and threats, which are legal issues, are somewhat containable.
In the balance, meanness oftentimes resonates with truth, not unlike humor. Like most tidal waves, what rolls in, rolls back out.
Take it with a grain of salt and go lightly to the next comment. Maybe the next comment author will satisfy your every ethicality.
Thank you Mr. Vidda
I appreciate your reply, though your points are hard to follow.
I agree with Vidda that we
I agree with Vidda that we all know the difference between a signature on a piece of legally relevant paper and an anonymous post. Plagiarism in colleges didn’t begin with the internet and actually it’s more traceable now because of the internet. Chris and Lise monitor the site and remove offensive posts as far as I know.
Here is the problem in my opinion on a “requirement” that posters use their real names. This is a small community and without able being to post anonymously you will lose people’s abilities to speak their own minds freely. There are too many close connections in this town for it not to affect people’s willingness to challenge or counter other’s statements.
Personally I wouldn’t want to give up my right to retain my confidentiality as far as my address, any sort of records, name or childrens’ names are concerned. I really try to verify any information I post here and can give cites to anyone who requests them. You may not agree with what I say or you may find it stated in a way that might be worded a bit too harshly for you but I can back it up with relevant information. Except of course in situations where I’ve provided actual quotes by people to the press and then stated why I found those quotes perplexing. If you don’t like someone commenting on what you said publicly to the press, don’t make statements to the press. Or at least don’t blame the “messenger” who asks you to explain your position.
If you require actual names you will end up with a “free speech” site that consists of pablum. Not all of us have the luxury of a local Doctor or some other people who can feel free to write what they really think without worrying about it affecting work situations or overall income for example. While a doctor might lose a patient or two, the reality is that most doctors seem to have a pretty captive collection of patients considering that they “announce” when they are accepting new patients
Most of us don’t have that luxury. Personally if I am working in town and working with someone else who posts here I would be quite reluctant to comment or disagree if that person is my boss or someone above me. I think that would be true of most who don’t have a lot of control over their working situations. There certainly is a long tradition in New England of Anonymous writings back to the colonial times. ..and for a reason. As long as Chris and Lise monitor the site for statements that are really offensive and not just offensive because you don’t like what the other person is saying I say let it be.
I don't think anyone is
I don’t think anyone is implying that teaching children to write their names or that the ability to read and write is not important. I’ve taken great pleasure in seeing my grandson learn to write his name and I am saddened by the demise of ‘penmanship” in lieu of teaching kids how to tap out letters on a keyboard.
The ability to be able to write one’s name had nothing to do with an adult’s choice to comment on this site or any other anonymously. The crux of this issue is that one of the posters on ibrattleboro continues to harangue and belittle those people who choose to use screen names. Being told consistently that one’s opinions have no worth or don’t matter because you didn’t sign your full name to your comment is not only incredibly rude but a form of verbal abuse. No one wants to be told their viewpoints are worthless. If someone is determined to stage a campaign against personal opinions then they should expect to get some less than friendly responses back. I firmly believe that you shouldn’t give it out if you can’t take it.
Regarding Mr. Wilmerding’s link to the anti cyber bullying project – I couldn’t agree more that cyber bullying is a horrible and vicious problem in this age of lightning fast technology. Young people are committing suicide because of being bullied so relentlessly by their peers and, in some cases by adults. It is a very real and dangerous problem that we should be trying much harder to alleviate.
I do find a particular irony in the fact that someone who belittles fellow posters on this site would then feel that he was the victim of being bullied and thus, post a link that – although valuable – has nothing at all to do with what is happening on this site. People are sharing their personal opinions about various topics and should be able to do so freely without being verbally accosted by someone who believes only he can make us all see the error of our ways: namely, using screen names.
Many great works of literature and art and politics have been created by “anonymous”. Should we all then say that those are of no worth because they weren’t signed by the author or artist?
No Preference
The topic has come up before about people using their given names vs screen names. I have no preference, for either myself or others. I was asked upon registering to fill in a screen name so I did. And sometimes a screen name can say something about a person, too.
1) If I don’t “know” a person by their actual name, then I don’t know them by their screen name either, so the issue of someone posting “anonymously” should matter very little in that sense.
2) This being a rather localized site tends to create a familiarity with those who are posting whether they are known to us or not.. what would the goal be in knowing an actual name, then? Although I don’t personally know most people here .. yet I know who some people are, whether they’re using a screen name or not, and there are many people who call me by my screen name rather than my actual name based solely on my presence here.. it is how they came to know me so sticks with them once they’ve met me in person.
3) I think at one time or another we’ve all ben insulted, ganged up on, lambasted, bullied and kicked around. I guess if I knew who everyone really was, I could send a thank-you note when they do something nice – just kidding but it does make me wonder why it would matter if I knew a name behind a post or not; I either agree or disagree, find the post humorous or not, learn something new or adopt a new perspective I might not have been enlightened to on my own, otherwise, or realize I’m conversing with a person who in real life would not want to be my friend, anyway, so it matters little what their actual name may be.
4) I don’t think that “hiding” behind a name is what people are doing when they lash out and “bully” others.. I feel they’d be the same whether more personally known or not. Take a look at Facebook; stories abound of being openly bullied, shamed or ganged up on there; enough so that I’d draw this conclusion – people have viewpoints, opinions and will do and say either kind or mean things based on who they are, not what name they use.
5) When registering to use iBrattleboro, are we not asked to provide a screen name? And, what would any of us do differently if everyone used their actual names rather than a screen name? I think I question what benefit there would be to knowing a real name as opposed to a screen name and question also whether it makes any difference in terms of what anyone would choose to post or reply to. People are mature or immature .. happy and go-lucky or angry.. and group according to what’s available to them; there are as many people who would be uninterested in “signing up” anywhere online as there are people who seem to pop up everywhere online
6) If anything, I would believe the effect is actually a reverse of sorts; those who find they can speak their minds on topics posted here and elsewhere (whether based on their “anonymity” or not) may tend to be even more vocal in the real world than they would otherwise be. If find this to be a more logical belief for me to hold as otherwise, I’d have to believe that there are very few honest people in the world. To have complaint about those who use screen names kinda makes me think of list keepers and the horrible stories that go with them.
Identity is always an option...
I have no problem with whatever iBrattleboro decides as a policy. It is their site after all. I still lean towards signed posts for myself and appreciate when others do the same. I remember once getting personally attacked by someone on Facebook and because their name was posted I was able to contact them and straighten out the misunderstanding.
I got really pissed off at someone who pulled out of parking place without bothering to look for oncoming traffic. I was about to do something I might have regretted when I noticed they were an acquaintance here in town. The general sense of anonymity we often feel in traffic was gone and I modified my response.
The Huffington Post has been struggling with anonymous accounts (which is different than anonymous posting on confirmed accounts as on iBrattleboro). Some of the issues are related to this discussion. Here is the link to their article about anonymous posts and anonymous accounts. I particularly like their references to a passage in ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jimmy-soni/why-is-huffpost-ending-an_b_3817979.html
I am surprised to hear that some feel unsafe posting under their own name in our community. VT Digger requires posts to be signed and I find the discussion there to be far from pablum. It is usually a pretty rough and tumble – though respectful – online environment.
The letters page in a newspaper always involves real names and places of residence. Identity is part of context and context is part of content.
In closing I would say that the discussion is far bigger than iBrattleboro – which continues to be a fairly friendly little forum for community conversation. Our children are growing up in a world of anonymous threats, insults and a complete lack of accountability for online mayhem. There are a number of respectable commentators on the development of online culture who have written extensively on anonymity. Javon Lanier and Nicholas Carr come to mind.
Andy Davis
Anonymity & Pseudonyms Promotes...Excercise of 1st Amendment
Anonymity and the freedom to use a pseudonym encourages people to freely express their opinions and ideas and promotes the exercise of First Amendment Rights as guaranteed by the Constitution.
People are free to ignore rude or inappropriate remarks as they wish and while outright lies may actually cause harm to an individual, suppressing free expression by requiring an individual to identify themselves may be a greater harm to society in general. I liken it to requiring a voter to divulge who he voted for. Such a requirement would undermine Democracy.
Certainly great and opinionated writers from the past would agree with me.
One writer in particular who wrote under the pseudonyms of Martha Careful, Polly Baker, Silence Dogood and Richard Saunders was none other than Benjamin Franklin. Likewise, revolutionary Thomas Paine published anonymously his famous pamphlet Common Sense advocating for American independence. Other well known authors have adopted pseudonyms to protect their personal privacy.